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Carl Crawford

One bad inning again dooms Francisco Liriano and Twins

Full story: TwinCities.com

ST. PETERSBURG, Fla. - This was the test Francisco Liriano needed to pass. His first two innings started like so many of his games - nearly seamless, quite fluid and most certainly under control.

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maradona lives

Buckhannon, WV

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#1
May 30, 2009
 

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I posted a couple of days ago that d young is struggling mightlity and needs to head to aaa. I got several responces, long in wind and short in intelligent substance. Care for another essay on Young and his potential, boys? Let's hear it!

Since: Mar 09

Saint Augustine, FL

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#2
May 30, 2009
 

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What is with this team, especially on the road? I think it is time to question Gardenhire's leadership. They seem to have no spark or confidence on the road. I think they have the worst road record of any MLB team this year. Everytime they fall behind on the road, it is usually over and you might as well turn the game off.

“At least I admit I'm a fool.”

Since: May 09

Madeuppington, Fakeasota

ISP: Saint Paul, MN

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#3
May 30, 2009
 

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Gypsy Cab wrote:
What is with this team, especially on the road? I think it is time to question Gardenhire's leadership. They seem to have no spark or confidence on the road. I think they have the worst road record of any MLB team this year. Everytime they fall behind on the road, it is usually over and you might as well turn the game off.
I think Gardenhire seems like a great guy, so I am definitely not just being negative about him because I don't like him, but it does seem like it might be time to try another manager and strategy. Maybe next year we can have a clean sweep - every major team can have a new coaching staff leading the way! At least it would be a fun year of second guessing first year coaches and managers!
Hey Rube

Brooklyn, NY

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#4
May 30, 2009
 

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This should have been flagged for being completely retarded (and I mean that as impeding progress)...why would you get rid of a coaching staff that nearly went to the playoffs last year and has been there over and over again since Gardy took over? Why...maybe moving liriano to the pen and dickey to the rotation would help? As for the comment about young, when's the last time you're mother died....A$$HOLE!...seriously, the dude is hurting, there are some things that are bigger than baseball. Seriously.
Integillentz wrote:
<quoted text>
I think Gardenhire seems like a great guy, so I am definitely not just being negative about him because I don't like him, but it does seem like it might be time to try another manager and strategy. Maybe next year we can have a clean sweep - every major team can have a new coaching staff leading the way! At least it would be a fun year of second guessing first year coaches and managers!
Arrogant American

Lakeville, MN

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#5
May 30, 2009
 

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maradona lives wrote:
I posted a couple of days ago that d young is struggling mightlity and needs to head to aaa. I got several responces, long in wind and short in intelligent substance. Care for another essay on Young and his potential, boys? Let's hear it!
Delmon Young hit .290 last year and .288 the year before that. He has proven that he is a solid major league hitter. Do you really think they've even considered sending him down?
hdog

Le Center, MN

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#6
May 30, 2009
 

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Liriano would be perfect for a couple of good middle-relief innnings. Due to the surgery he's lost his touch, and that's the end of it. Sad that he can't be the pitcher he could have been. Time to move on and replace him in the rotation before he bungles any more games.
hdog

Le Center, MN

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#7
May 30, 2009
 

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maradona lives wrote:
I posted a couple of days ago that d young is struggling mightlity and needs to head to aaa. I got several responces, long in wind and short in intelligent substance. Care for another essay on Young and his potential, boys? Let's hear it!
You're correct. Great human, and he did just lose his Mom, but his hitting was mediocre and his fielding/throwing arm even worse, long before his personal difficulties, so his recent hardship doesn't excuse his playing. I appreciate the sympathy shown him by posters, but this is a professional sport and we need to win. If he has other things on his mind, he shouldn't be playing.

And a thing I forgot to add......true, Liriano partially blew another game, but he wasn't THAT bad. Let's not forget our completely crappy offense. Once again, Cuddy is back in the doghouse...him striking out three or four times doesn't help the pitcher's cause much. I thought he said he was done swinging at low pitches a mile out of the strike zone.

“"We're the pros from Dover"”

Since: Jan 09

Zumbrota, MN

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#8
May 30, 2009
 

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Arrogant American wrote:
<quoted text>
Delmon Young hit .290 last year and .288 the year before that. He has proven that he is a solid major league hitter. Do you really think they've even considered sending him down?
Delmon hit a decent .288 in '07, he hit among the emptiest .290s last year, especially for a corner outfielder. He produced few runs and made a lot of outs. His outfield defense was abysmal. This year it has only gotten worse. He's got over 100 plate appearances and two extra base hits. He should not be playing in the majors the way he is swinging the bat.

“"We're the pros from Dover"”

Since: Jan 09

Zumbrota, MN

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#9
May 30, 2009
 

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hdog wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again, Cuddy is back in the doghouse...him striking out three or four times doesn't help the pitcher's cause much. I thought he said he was done swinging at low pitches a mile out of the strike zone.
I didn't see all the game, but I did catch all three of Cuddy's Ks. He struck out on high fastballs at least twice and I believe all three times. Yeah, he had a lousy game, but he had company. Only six hits and no one with more than one and 0-9 with runners in scoring position. The Twins were very lucky to get two runs home.

“At least I admit I'm a fool.”

Since: May 09

Madeuppington, Fakeasota

ISP: Saint Paul, MN

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#10
May 31, 2009
 

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Hey Rube wrote:
This should have been flagged for being completely retarded (and I mean that as impeding progress)...why would you get rid of a coaching staff that nearly went to the playoffs last year and has been there over and over again since Gardy took over? Why...maybe moving liriano to the pen and dickey to the rotation would help? As for the comment about young, when's the last time you're mother died....**** HOLE!...seriously, the dude is hurting, there are some things that are bigger than baseball. Seriously.
<quoted text>
It is not as though these comments are on a serious subject, so you might want to tone down on the "retarded" talk...bonehead :-)

Anywho - I wonder how much input Gardenhire has had in the various trades that squandered away huge talent like Garza, Bartlett, Ortiz...just to name a few. I know he is not the guy who makes that call, but he has input. Bartlett and Ortiz try to be polite when they talk about playing for the Twins, but basically they say that they blossomed after they left because the Twins coaching staff was trying to make them into something that they were not. I think Gardenhire needs to take responsibility for that. As for Young, he has never played well enough to justify the trade - that one was a total bust.

Almost got to the playoffs...almost. And when we have been to the playoffs what has happened? All I'm saying is that they might be getting into a rut where a almost getting to the playoffs is good enough, and that is not a good thing.
duslog24

Osseo, MN

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#11
May 31, 2009
 

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Liriano is AAA material. He is obviously finished from what he was before he got hurt.
opTOMism

Cape Coral, FL

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#12
May 31, 2009
 

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It appears he has lost the arm strength and confidence that is necessary to be successful in the big leagues. Send him to Rochester for the remainder of this season and see if he can become a pitcher instead of the power thrower he once was.
Tybalt

Saint Paul, MN

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#13
May 31, 2009
 
i'm confused too. i don't know what to do either. send him to the bullpen.

“Are you serious?”

Since: Mar 08

Da Range

ISP: Arcadia, WI

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#14
May 31, 2009
 
Is the ownership still glad they got rid of Santana? Idiots. They will always be second rung.
GBH1055

Birmingham, MI

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#15
May 31, 2009
 

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Liriano is struggling but at least he is battling out there. His defense has to help him more. Harris killed him a couple of times yesterday. It could have changed everything. There was no excuse. Young is the one that should go to the minors. He is embarrassing himself.
Arrogant American

Lakeville, MN

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#16
May 31, 2009
 

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Flatblade wrote:
<quoted text>
Delmon hit a decent .288 in '07, he hit among the emptiest .290s last year, especially for a corner outfielder. He produced few runs and made a lot of outs. His outfield defense was abysmal. This year it has only gotten worse. He's got over 100 plate appearances and two extra base hits. He should not be playing in the majors the way he is swinging the bat.
David Ortiz is hitting only .185. Should he be sent down? Delmon Young has been distracted by the death of his mother. You know that he's not a .236-hitter. By the end of the season, Young will be close to .300.

After 1468 major league at bats, Roberto Clemente was hitting .275. After 1452 major league at bats, Delmon Young was hitting .288. At this point in their careers, Delmon had 27 home runs and 186 RBI. Clemente had 16 home runs and 137 RBI. Delmon had 28 stolen bases, compared to Clemente's eight.

Considering that Young's numbers are better than Clemente's, at this point in their careers, you probably would have been in favor of sending Clemente down. Don't give up on Young, he is going to be a star.
Arrogant American

Lakeville, MN

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#17
May 31, 2009
 

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Flatblade wrote:
<quoted text>
Only six hits and no one with more than one and 0-9 with runners in scoring position. The Twins were very lucky to get two runs home.
They should have had at least one run in the second innning.

With two outs and Joe Crede on first, Carlos Gomez hit a ground ball back to the pitcher. The throw to first was thrown down the line. Crede was jogging to second, assuming the play would be made. Because he did not hustle, he was unable to score on the overthrow.

“"We're the pros from Dover"”

Since: Jan 09

Zumbrota, MN

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#18
May 31, 2009
 

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Integillentz wrote:
<quoted text>
It is not as though these comments are on a serious subject, so you might want to tone down on the "retarded" talk...bonehead :-)
Anywho - I wonder how much input Gardenhire has had in the various trades that squandered away huge talent like Garza, Bartlett, Ortiz...just to name a few. I know he is not the guy who makes that call, but he has input. Bartlett and Ortiz try to be polite when they talk about playing for the Twins, but basically they say that they blossomed after they left because the Twins coaching staff was trying to make them into something that they were not. I think Gardenhire needs to take responsibility for that. As for Young, he has never played well enough to justify the trade - that one was a total bust.
Almost got to the playoffs...almost. And when we have been to the playoffs what has happened? All I'm saying is that they might be getting into a rut where a almost getting to the playoffs is good enough, and that is not a good thing.
Ortiz was let go when Terry Ryan was GM, and Kelly was manager. Don't put that on this regime. Bartlett has had a great 1/3 season, but his track record indicates he is about an average starting shortstop, better than the Twins have, but no world beater. Garza has thrived away from Minnesota. Actually, many would have predicted that. I am very disappointed in the returns for both of the big trades made before last season. Delmon Young is not what was advertised and has regressed this year. He may also benefit from a change of scenery.

“"We're the pros from Dover"”

Since: Jan 09

Zumbrota, MN

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#19
May 31, 2009
 

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Arrogant American wrote:
<quoted text>
David Ortiz is hitting only .185. Should he be sent down? Delmon Young has been distracted by the death of his mother. You know that he's not a .236-hitter. By the end of the season, Young will be close to .300.
After 1468 major league at bats, Roberto Clemente was hitting .275. After 1452 major league at bats, Delmon Young was hitting .288. At this point in their careers, Delmon had 27 home runs and 186 RBI. Clemente had 16 home runs and 137 RBI. Delmon had 28 stolen bases, compared to Clemente's eight.
Considering that Young's numbers are better than Clemente's, at this point in their careers, you probably would have been in favor of sending Clemente down. Don't give up on Young, he is going to be a star.
Did Roberto Clemente swing at 75% of first pitches? Did Roberto chase all manner of pitches outside the zone? It could happen that Delmon will see the light, but I sincerely doubt it.

Delmon Young was a man among boys in the minors. Now that he is a man among men, the flaws in his approach and his lack of selectivity take away almost all of his athletic gifts. He has been in the big leagues for about two and a half years and has made zero progress. The great ones, even the good ones, can make adjustments, Delmon Young, to date, has made no adjustments.

Losing a loved one is hard. It probably has exacerbated the problems that Young has as a baseball player. He won't continue to be this bad forever. However, I doubt he will ever be a better player than average. Despite an early start in the majors, I doubt his career numbers will amount to anything special.

“Aspiring Human”

Since: Jan 09

Florida

ISP: Gainesville, FL

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#20
May 31, 2009
 

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Arrogant American wrote:
<quoted text>
David Ortiz is hitting only .185. Should he be sent down? Delmon Young has been distracted by the death of his mother. You know that he's not a .236-hitter. By the end of the season, Young will be close to .300.
After 1468 major league at bats, Roberto Clemente was hitting .275. After 1452 major league at bats, Delmon Young was hitting .288. At this point in their careers, Delmon had 27 home runs and 186 RBI. Clemente had 16 home runs and 137 RBI. Delmon had 28 stolen bases, compared to Clemente's eight.
Considering that Young's numbers are better than Clemente's, at this point in their careers, you probably would have been in favor of sending Clemente down. Don't give up on Young, he is going to be a star.
Interesting perspective!
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