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Dr Who

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#1
Aug 12, 2006
 

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American cars are truely terrible, no offense to Americans but you just cant build cars. American cars tend to be cheap and nasty and lack the ability to drive round corners due to the weak and flexible chasis and poor stearing abilities. Even the so called classic American cars like the Corvette and Dodge Viper are truely awful cars. I drove the Dodge viper not long ago and i was amazed at how bad the car was. The Corvette C6 has a great engine, but if you gave an engine that size to a European engineer he would come up with a damn site more power than that.

Just look at the quality of European cars compared to American cars. Look at Jaguar, Aston Martin, BMW, Mercedes, Porsche, Maserati, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Bugatti, Volvo, Saab, Volkswagon and Rolls Royce. Compare these to the so-called quality American cars like Chrysler, Dodge, Ford, Chevrolet and Cadillac. Granted the Ford GT is a magnificent car but the chasi is poor and doesnt cope well on corners and bends. This is typical of American cars and as i mentioned before the cheap interiors made of plastic. However the Ford GT was designed on the old GT 40 which was a British designed and British built car.

in my opinion the best cars are Italian, German and British. even though Italian cars can be unreliable they are still the best handeling, the most luxurious and the most fun to drive. European cars have interiors made of exspensive leathers and chromes and handle perfectly. The technologies in European and Japanese cars are also more advanced than American cars. I like Japanese cars, but i just think most of them lack the soul and passion that great European cars are built with.

American cars can be quite good looking, just look at the Mustang and Dodge Charger, but they are so bad to drive and it amazes me how some people can live with cars that are so bad.

French cars i also like although they tend to be quite cheap, they do handle amazingly and are always very comfortable to drive. Peugeot have made some fantastic cars over the years such as the 406, 205 GTI, 306 and the new 407. all these cars handle amazingly, are comfortable and good looking - especially the new 407. Infact i would say that the French make the best 4 door saloon cars designed for families and long trips.
snowmobiler

Brookfield, WI

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#2
Aug 22, 2006
 

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wow that was very in-depth ...not. I doubt youve even driven any of the cars you listed on there. You're a moron, plain and simple, learn a little something about the double-standard before you start talking shit buddy.
Dr Who

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#3
Aug 24, 2006
 

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snowmobiler wrote:
wow that was very in-depth ...not. I doubt youve even driven any of the cars you listed on there. You're a moron, plain and simple, learn a little something about the double-standard before you start talking shit buddy.
obviously you know nothing about cars other wise you wouldnt have come up with that insulting shit you just did!

sorry to insult your national pride buddy, but americans just cant build cars, and the rest of the world knows this. american cars suck, most of them are just cheap crap and they cant turn round corners, which is why they are so slow compared to european and japanese cars. trust me i have had the misfortune of driving the dodge viper and it was without doubt the worst car i have ever driven in my entire life. it amazes me that the engineers thought that car was ready to sell cause it is absoloutly crap. just like most american cars the chassi was sh*t and could not handle the corners at speed. the interior like most american cars was cheap and dull with plastics everywhere.

if you knew anything about cars you would know that european cars are faster, better quality and more reliable, the same goes for japanese. try putting a nissan skyline GTR or a TVR Sagaris up against the mustang and your mustang will get slaughtered.

why do you think american cars sell so badly in europe and japan?- the answer is that they are too cheap and the quality is extemely poor, we just make better car than america does. simple as that.

chrysler are starting to use the nurburgring in germany to design their cars and improve their handeling becuase they are learning that the typical american car is just sh*t and more needs to be done if they want to succeed on the international market.

again if you put up a car like the ferrari f430 against the ford GT on the nurburgring, the ferrari having 100 horse power less would slaughter the ford GT, which has over 500 horse power, simply becuase the american chassi would not be able to cope with all the corners and bends.

sorry but americans cant build cars, and every american car i have been in has been shockingly bad. trust me i know a thing or two about cars cause i work at a race track and at my track we dont employ american cars becuase they can handle the track properly.

the corvette c6 uses leaf springs for its rear suspension, which is ancient technology and the car suffers for this. the new mustang despite being a very good looking car is full of cheap plastics, which again is typical of american cars. i think the worst example of a cheap plastic interior would be the lincoln navigator. but the worst cars of all are without a doubt cadillacs.

untill america can build a car to rival euro and japanese cars such as the skyline, ferrari enzo, pagani zonda, lamborghini murcielago, subaru impreza, porsche 911 turbo, ferrari f430 and the TVR sagaris not only in terms of chassi design and handeling, but also in quality, american cars will always have the reputation of being sh*t
Dr Who

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#4
Aug 25, 2006
 

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I would like to add that one thing that really annoys me about some companies is their attempts to specific types of cars for specific purposes that the car just cant perform. BMW are guilty of this with their off-road X3 and X5, which cant go off road at all. The X3 and X5 are just big gas guzzeling heaps of crap. It seems to me that they are just built to give the off-road feel and safety to mums taking the kids on the school run in built up city areas. Its no wonder the government is raising the taxes on these cars. I just wish ot was only people who needed 4 wheel drive off roaders who used them, people in rural areas for example.

At my track we do have off-road experiences for people where they can tackle a dirt assault course in a Landrover Disco or a Jeep Grand Cherokee, and these ares do the job very well. But i have seen others take their own X3 or X5 and they were just incapable of doing the job.
Dr Who

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#6
Aug 26, 2006
 

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GLB you use too many american websites to be taken seriously.

1. the ford GT is not british, but the original ford GT 40 was designed and built in britian and defeated ferrari 4 times at le mans. the new GT is styled on the old one, except the chassi remains american and does not handle corners and bends very well. the chassi not being stiff enough means the GT cant put down all its horse power onto the tar-mack, which is why a much less powefull f430 can get round a track quicker.

2. the nissan skyline GTR is more than a match for the mustang, the skyline has a better chassi and passive rear wheel stearing, which allows it to handle better and put down all of its power on the tar-mac. we have several skylines at my track, some of which have been tuned to produce nearly 600 bhp and they still cope magnificently. i guarentee you that no mustang could out-perform a skyline at its max potential

3. the 911 is a much faster car depending on what 911 you drive. the 911 GT3 would and has slaughtered the corvette c6 on the track, even the 911 turbo is a far superior car in terms of performance, quality and reliability.

4. the new ferrari 599 was built to a budget, and although i am not a professional racing driver, i have seen it at my track and have spoken to ferrari engineers about it. the reason the 599 uses a similar suspension system to the vette c6 is simply to save money, the car has many other flaws too such as the breaks and the interior is made of parts from older models to save money. ferrari themseleves claim the 516 scaglietti is a far superior car to its replacement. motoring journalists believe this too

5. yes GM does own Jag, Aston, Saab and so on, but these cars are still primarily designed and built in their countries of origin and so benefit from the superior engineering and qualities we have in europe.

6. as for the cadillac i have only had one experience of them my self when i hired one in nevada. the suspension was too soft and the car could not turn round corners even at low speed. cadillacs, buicks like most american cars do not sell in any great number in europe or japan, as they are cheap and of poor quality. the dependability rankings you provided featured many cars not sold else where in the world.

7. toyotas and hondas have untill recently been the best selling cars in the world. japanese cars played a big role in the colapse of the detroit motoring industry as they did in the british car industry because of greater reliability and quality.

american cars use too many cheap plastics for their interiors, and their chassis cant cope on a road that isnt straight. at my track people are free to bring their own cars and be taught how to race them so i do have to drive american cars even though we dont employ them. i assure you they are very far behind euro and japanes cars, but they are catching up very slowly. the newest corvette model recently went round several tracks faster than the original pagani zonda. however american cars still have a long way to go before they match the performance and sales of other cars accross the world.

my track currently has a ferrari 355,ferrari 516, f430, lamborghini murcielago, two 911 GT3, one 911 turbo, 5 skylines, jaguar xj220, honda nsx. although these cars are privately owned they are available to the public for the experience. we do however own our own single seat racers, legends, and several different makes of hot hatches, which are all european and japanese.

during motor fairs and events we do see more american cars put up against japanese cars and european supercars, which absoloutly thrash them on our track, and indeed any other track i have been to
GLB

Buena Park, CA

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#7
Aug 26, 2006
 

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Partner, you came blasting American autos on an American automobile forum. Then when confronted by facts from road tests done by respected sources, you insinuate they don't have any credibility because they are American websites. Fine, point me in the direction of some credible, foreign (to America) websites that corroborate your claims. I would find such reviews interesting reading.
bob

Battle Creek, MI

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#8
Sep 22, 2006
 

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i agree with whittier i got a 1993 buick park avenue and the only things i did to it in the 5 years i had it was water pump and alternator that it.. very heavy duty 138000 miles with 3.8 liter engine i stand with certain american models all the way
thetruthbringer

Mission Viejo, CA

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#9
Sep 28, 2006
 

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American cars are sooo much better than any other. the lower end ones do have to much plastic, but they still look allot better and more appealing. The motors dont hurt your ears when you pound on the throttle either, you actually enjoy hearing the motor rev. I own a cadillac xlr, and there isnt a single plastic thing in the cabin, and i can outrun any merc that comes my way(besides slr). Thats not saying that german or jap cars are crap, but american cars are better.
Scott Walsh

United States

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#10
Sep 28, 2006
 

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Actually the corvette Z06 ford gt and dodge viper will beat any car coming out of germany right now
txbasshound

Flint, MI

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#11
Oct 5, 2006
 

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Buy American...the job you save might be yours!
Besides all the fair trade issues etc...has everyone forgotten Pearl Harbor?
Dr Who

UK

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#13
Oct 9, 2006
 

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I dont like American cars at all, they are so slow, heavy and cheap compared to high performance Japanese and European cars. Iron Jaw is correct that American cars dont handle, ive rented plenty of them in the states and i hated all of them.

One major problem with all Cadillacs apart from being truely bad cars, is their image. The age of the average Cadillac owner is 59 years old!!!

Cadillacs are for OAP's in Florida retirement homes. Buicks cant turn round corners like all American cars, and Corvettes are just so cheap.

Another thing i can confirm is that the Dodge Viper has recieved very bad press out side America, because European and Japanese cars handle so much better and go so much faster. One professional racing driver said "i cant believe the engineers thought this car was ready to sell". All the car magazines are not very impressed either.

I think the problem is that most Americans have very little experience of superior European and japanese, build and handeling qualities, and compare other cars with American ones.

Cars like the Nissan Skyline are illegal in America becuase they are deemed too fast. America still hasnt produced a quality product like a Ferrari or Porsche.

Europe and Japan have alot of interest in American cars because of the "Rock'n'Roll" image that they have. But when you actually come to drive them they are the biggest disappointments ever. I was in a Lincoln Navigator the other week and it was cheap plastics everywhere in what was supposed to be a quality car.

Sorry folks, but American cars really do suck, which is why they dont sell outside America. Ford are just about the only exception, even Chrysler and Dodge dont sell in any great numbers despite being as cheap as they are.
thetruthbringer

Mission Viejo, CA

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#14
Oct 13, 2006
 

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I dont really know how you can be so naive hawk, but american cars are far superior, especially for the price, than european or japanese cars. First of all, of course you are going to hate the rental versions, because they are the cheapest pieces of crap ever produced, and the production versions of American cars are much better. So if you want to express your clearly wrong opinion, dont use rental cars as your excuse. Cadillac has done an excellent job in redefining their cars and image, they are now much sportier and better looking than anything coming out of Europe or Japan. They also realized that their interiors were to cheap and plastic, so they have now comlpetely redone all of their interiors, that rival the germans, just like most other American car companies. Buicks arent supposed to go around corners fast, or even go fast at all, it is a dying brand. As for the viper, the morons over in Europe dont realize what it actually is. Its a mechanical piece of crap, but with a huge motor WITHOUT A SUPERCHARGER, a true mans car! the Europeans just dont get that the high pitched squeal and lag of a supercharger is completely annoying and pointless. I Live in Orange County, so half of the cars are mercedes s or sl classes, or bmw 7 or m series. Even with all of those cars going down the road, most of us prefer the mean muscle or outstanding elegance of American cars. I have nothing against European or Japanese cars, but i just know that American cars are better. The Germans make quality interiors, but dont know how to design a car to look appealing, or have a decent motor, the only exception is on the cls 63. While the japs build bland reliability, and thats it.
GLB

United States

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#15
Oct 15, 2006
 

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"I dont like American cars at all, they are so slow, heavy and cheap compared to high performance Japanese and European cars. Iron Jaw is correct that American cars dont handle, ive rented plenty of them in the states and i hated all of them."

You are entitled to your opinion, but without any refernces(like iron jaw)it's just that, your opinion. Read the test results from the websites posted above; they definitely run counter to your learned opinion.

"One major problem with all Cadillacs apart from being truely bad cars, is their image. The age of the average Cadillac owner is 59 years old!!!"

Can you show me where you got that age from?
USA Today says the average age is nearer to 57; besides, what's your point? There are a lot of talented/sucessful people that fall into that age bracket.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/advertising/adt...
Cadillac has always targeted affluent buyers and it is now arguable that Caddy is the marquee bling-bling ride.

"Cadillacs are for OAP's in Florida retirement homes. Buicks cant turn round corners like all American cars, and Corvettes are just so cheap."

LOL. Any references?

"Another thing i can confirm is that the Dodge Viper has received very bad press out side America, because European and Japanese cars handle so much better and go so much faster. One professional racing driver said "i cant believe the engineers thought this car was ready to sell". All the car magazines are not very impressed either."

Please link to references that support your confirmation. I would like to read any of those magazine articles you mention. The test results shown here, http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp... , tell an entirely different tale from what you weave.

"I think the problem is that most Americans have very little experience of superior European and japanese, build and handling qualities, and compare other cars with American ones"

I think you know very little about Americans. As to supposedly superior European/Asian cars, everything I read has them neck and neck with American performance cars. http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp...
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Cars like the Nissan Skyline are illegal in America becuase they are deemed too fast. America still hasnt produced a quality product like a Ferrari or Porsche.

Deemed to fast? Thatís BS; Nissan has never marketed it in the US because they chose not to make it comply with US emissions standards: http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Features...

You can get them though: http://www.motorex.net/motorex.html

As to producing a quality product (like Ferrari or Porsche); again see this link: http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp...

"Europe and Japan have alot of interest in American cars because of the "Rock'n'Roll" image that they have. But when you actually come to drive them they are the biggest disappointments ever. I was in a Lincoln Navigator the other week and it was cheap plastics everywhere in what was supposed to be a quality car.

Sorry folks, but American cars really do suck, which is why they dont sell outside America. Ford are just about the only exception, even Chrysler and Dodge dont sell in any great numbers despite being as cheap as they are."

Ah, again the reference to cheap plastics, sounds reminiscent of iron jaw (is it a UK thing?). Websites posted in this thread repudiate his claims as well as yours.
To be fair, and as I asked him to do (which he hasn't) please post some test results from reputable websites that support you claims.

Anyone taking the time to read the posted links can form there own opinions, but it seems clear to me that American cars are as capable and comparable to automobiles made abroad. Prove it otherwise.
GLB

United States

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#16
Oct 15, 2006
 

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"I dont like American cars at all, they are so slow, heavy and cheap compared to high performance Japanese and European cars. Iron Jaw is correct that American cars dont handle, ive rented plenty of them in the states and i hated all of them."

You are entitled to your opinion, but without references (like iron jaw), it's just that, an opinion (Noun: opinion 1. A personal belief or judgment that is not founded on proof or certainty) Read the test results from the websites posted above; they definitely run counter to your opinion.

"One major problem with all Cadillacs apart from being truely bad cars, is their image. The age of the average Cadillac owner is 59 years old!!!"

Can you show me where you got that age from?
USA Today says the average age is nearer to 57; besides, what's your point? There are a lot of talented/sucessful people that fall into that age bracket.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/advertising/adt...
Cadillac has always targeted affluent buyers and it is now arguable that Caddy is the marquee bling-bling ride.

"Cadillacs are for OAP's in Florida retirement homes. Buicks cant turn round corners like all American cars, and Corvettes are just so cheap."

LOL. Any references?

"Another thing i can confirm is that the Dodge Viper has received very bad press out side America, because European and Japanese cars handle so much better and go so much faster. One professional racing driver said "i cant believe the engineers thought this car was ready to sell". All the car magazines are not very impressed either."

Please link to references that support your confirmation. I would like to read any of those magazine articles you mention. The test results shown here, http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp... , tell an entirely different tale from what you weave.

"I think the problem is that most Americans have very little experience of superior European and japanese, build and handling qualities, and compare other cars with American ones"

I think you know very little about Americans. As to supposedly superior European/Asian cars, everything I read has them neck and neck with American performance cars. http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp...
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Cars like the Nissan Skyline are illegal in America becuase they are deemed too fast. America still hasnt produced a quality product like a Ferrari or Porsche.

Deemed to fast? Thatís BS; Nissan has never marketed it in the US because they chose not to make it comply with US emissions standards: http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Features...

You can get them though: http://www.motorex.net/motorex.html

As to producing a quality product (like Ferrari or Porsche); again see this link: http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp...

"Europe and Japan have alot of interest in American cars because of the "Rock'n'Roll" image that they have. But when you actually come to drive them they are the biggest disappointments ever. I was in a Lincoln Navigator the other week and it was cheap plastics everywhere in what was supposed to be a quality car.

Sorry folks, but American cars really do suck, which is why they dont sell outside America. Ford are just about the only exception, even Chrysler and Dodge dont sell in any great numbers despite being as cheap as they are."

Ah, again the reference to cheap plastics, sounds reminiscent of iron jaw (is it a UK thing?). Websites posted in this thread repudiate his claims as well as yours.
To be fair, and as I asked him to do (which he hasn't) please post some test results from reputable websites that support you claims.

Anyone taking the time to read the posted links can form there own opinions, but it seems clear to me that American cars are as capable and comparable to automobiles made abroad. Prove it otherwise.
Dr Who

UK

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#17
Oct 16, 2006
 

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I dont know any websites, i prefer magazines and tv shows. Sorry but i just dont like American cars, and i agree with what iron jaw said. they are extremely unpopular and none of them compare to porsche, ferrari, lamborghini, bugatti, aston martin, jaguar, mercedes, bently, rolls royce, ventura, marcos, tvr, bmw, lotus, ariel, bristol, lexus and so on.

America makes good looking cars but they are rubbish to drive and the chassis can only cope on straight roads. cadillacs, buicks, dodge, chevrolet, lincoln, chrysler and so on are rubbish. if you tried to race any of them against european rivals, the europeans would win hands down.

im a big fan of the show top gear, i dont know if you get that in the usa? but is shows american cars put up against european cars all the time and european cars always out perform them in every way - speed, handeling, power, quality, pedigree and so on. Americans just dont get luxury, to an american luxury just means making something bigger.

Top gear said "americans cant build cars" and they prove this right every week the shows on. Sorry but i have to agree with iron jaw on this one, given the choice i would rather have a ferrari or lamborghini than a caddillac, dodge or corvette
GLB

United States

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#18
Oct 16, 2006
 

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Your preferences are duly noted. Why come to an obscure Dodge forum to state them? Is this forum that popular with non-Dodge drivers in the UK?

"...to an american luxury just means making something bigger."
Again, it is evident that you know very little about us.

Top Gear does air every once in a while here. I remember an episode where they were testing sports cars by driving them on a beach. BTW, here is a quote from their website concerning the Corvette Z05: "And there's one further good reason for those with the means to seriously ponder buying one: the £60,000 price tag. Driven back to back with a Lamborghini Gallardo or a Ferrari F430, the Z06 would be every bit as rapid; yet you could buy yourself two of these for the price of either."
http://www.topgear.com/drives/CB/A1/roadtests...
Dr Who

UK

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#19
Oct 17, 2006
 

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i came here cause i noticed it when browsing.

i dont hate american cars, american cars are good looking and have bags of personality, but they are just so disappointing to drive compared to our high performance cars. i drove a mustang round a bend one day and i could actually feel the chassi flexing, which is something i feel in every american car i have driven. i just wish american cars would have stiffer chassis and be alot more powefull. i love cars more than anything, but if i had the money i would definatley buy a ferrari enzo or a lambo than any american car.

Come on you have to admit it, nothing beats a ferrari, ferrari are like the god of cars, and look at the worlds fastest car - the bugatti veyron, only the italians can make something so beautiful and so fast.
Dr Who

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#20
Oct 17, 2006
 

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Also look at F1 racing, which is the most advanced racing car in the world. America has almost nothing to with F1, there is only one american driver and he is the first american in a decade.

While the rest of the world is involved in F1, america is still into the NASCAR and INDYCAR stuff, which is just really driving round in circles. I think the reason that vette you mentioned was so cheap is because the ferraris offer more in quality and reliability, such as leather trimmed interiers and second to none customer care.
Dr Who

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#21
Oct 17, 2006
 

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If i was rich enough i would still buy a ferrari enzo or a mclaren f1 probably
GLB

United States

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#22
Oct 17, 2006
 

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I think Ferrari makes some fine cars (as do a lot of other makers). I've never argued that point. I admire many of the cars that the Italians make (they do have a flair). My point is that American cars are very capable. If you don't like them that's fine by me, but I totally disagree with a lot of the points you try to make.

BTW, the Corvette mentioned has a leather interior.
I've found that service varies greatly dealer to dealer regardless of make.

Unfortunately (and this is my opinion), F1 is seen by many in the US as an elitest sport with no roots in America (or participation by the big three). We tend to prefer our own homegrown sports (ie NFL, baseball, and basketball)and racing is no different(to each their own I guess). Indy has it roots in flat track and NASCAR is seen as a "Thunder Road" thing with a large makers following. It will be interesting to see how Toyota does in it. Drag racing is still a huge thing here and probably will always be when you can race what you drive in many classes. TransAm and touring class racing is popular as well. Speaking of motor sports; any demolition derbies or truck racing in Europe (very popular here)?

Again, good luck with the Enzo or F1.

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