Why Black Christians Bother Me

Let me add that Black ZEALOTS of ANY religion perturb the hell out of me (no pun intended).

If universal spirituality is TRULY understood, then it is of no consequence what religious faith one chooses as their spiritual instrumentation.

sassy74 wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't believe you know "most" Black Christians. There are as many ways to be Christian as there are to be Black. Maybe you've met some deluded-acting people where you are, but you don't know most of us to be making these kinds of sweeping generalizations. I can disagree with everything on your "starter list".

Thank you for your response.. I always find it funny in discussion forums when people try to invalidate generalizations. When polls are done, and statistics are given do you think the pollster spoke to every single person of that race? in that town? etc..whatever the subject my be. No. A conclusion is drawn, and later used by people as a fact.

Discussions, debates are basically strong opinions drawn from experience and backed by facts. So, if you have never experienced another religion outside of christianity, you lack the experience and will not understand my points b/c you have nothing to compare it to. I will leave you with a few facts to back my strong opinion...Can you disagree with these.

Fact 1

Christianity is the No.1 religion for American Blacks.

Fact 2

American blacks were introduced to christianity as a control mechanism by slave masters.

Fact 3

All sins in christianity will be paid for in the afterlife...there are no punishment systems in place for members of christian orginizations.

sassy74 wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't believe you know "most" Black Christians. There are as many ways to be Christian as there are to be Black. Maybe you've met some deluded-acting people where you are, but you don't know most of us to be making these kinds of sweeping generalizations. I can disagree with everything on your "starter list".

sassy74 wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't believe you know "most" Black Christians. There are as many ways to be Christian as there are to be Black. Maybe you've met some deluded-acting people where you are, but you don't know most of us to be making these kinds of sweeping generalizations. I can disagree with everything on your "starter list".

Thank you for your response.. I always find it funny in discussion forums when people try to invalidate generalizations. When polls are done, and statistics are given do you think the pollster spoke to every single person of that race? in that town? etc..whatever the subject my be. No. A conclusion is drawn, and later used by people as a fact.

Discussions, debates are basically strong opinions drawn from experience and backed by facts. So, if you have never experienced another religion outside of christianity, you lack the experience and will not understand my points b/c you have nothing to compare it to. I will leave you with a few facts to back my strong opinion...Can you disagree with these.

Fact 1

Christianity is the No.1 religion for American Blacks.

Fact 2

American blacks were introduced to christianity as a control mechanism by slave masters.

Fact 3

All sins in christianity will be paid for in the afterlife...there are no punishment systems in place for members of christian orginizations.

justiz4once wrote:

1. Most christians were born into the religion. They got blind faith from their mom, who got it from their mom, who got it from the slave master as a control mechanism.
2. They lack understanding of the religion..the just follow something most of them can barely explain christianity
3. Their religion is not a way of life from them. The play christian on sunday. No discipline. Every action is forgiven with no real recourse. They eat themselves into bad health...and just pray to be healed...no personal responsibility.
4. They spend their lives preparing for the afterlife and do nothing about the present.
5. The act as if any other religion is extreme.
6. The religion teaches no knowledge of self.
this is a starter list...

In your latest post you acknowledge your use of statistical information of sorts to validate your argument. That is not apparent here, where what you state appears to be based solely on your opinion. That is what I was disagreeing with. It's only later that you come back with "statistical" information. And I maintain my position that there are as many ways to be Christian as there are to be Black. I can only speak authoratatively on my own experience:

1. I was raised Christian, but that did not keep me from examining my faith and exploring others. I gained a testimony of my own faith after many years of searching, even though I was raised Christian. No "blind faith" here.

2.I understand my faith and can explain it with no problem.

3. My religion is a way of life for me. No caffeine, no illegal anything, no alcohol. No shopping on Sundays. Adding to my testimony is a daily thing, and even when things are not going the way I want, I look for the hand of God in everything. We are admonished to eat properly (mainly fruit, vegetables and whole grains, meat sparingly) and get exercise to maintain good health. We acknowledge personal responsibility in all that we do.

4. For folks in my faith, preparing for the afterlife IS taking care of the present. The quality of our lives now will be reflected in our afterlife.

5.I respect the right of others to worship God, or not, as they so choose. I reserve the same right for myself.

6.My faith is centered on a knowledge of self and of family history and lineage.

I can't disagree with your findings that most Black Americans are Christians. But there are a lot of variations there that you don't acknowledge in your initial post, which is the one I responded to.

justiz4once wrote:

<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Thank you for your response.. I always find it funny in discussion forums when people try to invalidate generalizations. When polls are done, and statistics are given do you think the pollster spoke to every single person of that race? in that town? etc..whatever the subject my be. No. A conclusion is drawn, and later used by people as a fact.
Discussions, debates are basically strong opinions drawn from experience and backed by facts. So, if you have never experienced another religion outside of christianity, you lack the experience and will not understand my points b/c you have nothing to compare it to. I will leave you with a few facts to back my strong opinion...Can you disagree with these.
Fact 1
Christianity is the No.1 religion for American Blacks.
Fact 2
American blacks were introduced to christianity as a control mechanism by slave masters.
Fact 3
All sins in christianity will be paid for in the afterlife...there are no punishment systems in place for members of christian orginizations.

I won't disagree that Christianity is the number one religion among Black Americans. I can agree that forms of Christianity were used as control mechanisms by slaveowners, but not all Black Americans of the time were introduced to Christianity that way. Black Americans took Christianity and put their own stamp on it, and introduced it to their children that way. All sins in Christianity are definitely NOT paid for in the afterlife. Punishment systems are definitely in place for transgressors, with excommunication being one of the strongest penalties imposed by many Christian churches. In my own church, there is an arduous process by which serious transgressions are dealt with. Haven't you ever heard "the wages of sin is death"? It's true. Look at the living hell many people are living in, of their own making.

WHITE MANS RELIGION, nuff said.

njfashionista wrote:

Can this not be said of all religions? Most people are born into their faith and many don't adhere to their religion's practices.
Growing up around a lot of Jewish people I saw the same things. I live near Philadelphia which has a large black Muslim population and the only thing Muslim about a lot of them are their beards.
Why single out black Christians?

as of 2007 the estimated six fastest growing religions of the world were Islam (1.84%), the Bahá'í Faith (1.7%), Sikhism (1.62%), Jainism (1.57%), Hinduism (1.52%), and Buddhism (1.32%)

People are born christian, they rarely convert to christianity wait...(let me not leave out the missionaries who force there word/religion onto the starving disadvantage people in 2nd-3rd world countries..coercing them with a piece of bread..and informing them that there life sucks b/c they haven't accepted Jesus Christ as their lord and saviour.)

Moving on.
I am singling out black christians, b/c they have whole-heartedly taking on the religion of their oppressor w/o question! How does that add up in comparison to the Jews and Black Muslims you speak of..

sassy74 wrote:

<quoted text>
I won't disagree that Christianity is the number one religion among Black Americans. I can agree that forms of Christianity were used as control mechanisms by slaveowners, but not all Black Americans of the time were introduced to Christianity that way. Black Americans took Christianity and put their own stamp on it, and introduced it to their children that way. All sins in Christianity are definitely NOT paid for in the afterlife. Punishment systems are definitely in place for transgressors, with excommunication being one of the strongest penalties imposed by many Christian churches. In my own church, there is an arduous process by which serious transgressions are dealt with. Haven't you ever heard "the wages of sin is death"? It's true. Look at the living hell many people are living in, of their own making.

LOL...and what's a serious transgression in your church?

And please elaborate on the black stamp..

is it the learn hopelessness ...PUSH ( Pray Until Something Happens)

or that every so familiar hand wave in the air that blk women do in church when they are feelin the service. You know the one that dates back to slave accountability during service.

What about this whole peace thing??? Being that god was the biggest killer of all times.

justiz4once wrote:

<quoted text>
as of 2007 the estimated six fastest growing religions of the world were Islam (1.84%), the Bahá'í Faith (1.7%), Sikhism (1.62%), Jainism (1.57%), Hinduism (1.52%), and Buddhism (1.32%)
People are born christian, they rarely convert to christianity wait...(let me not leave out the missionaries who force there word/religion onto the starving disadvantage people in 2nd-3rd world countries..coercing them with a piece of bread..and informing them that there life sucks b/c they haven't accepted Jesus Christ as their lord and saviour.)
Moving on.
I am singling out black christians, b/c they have whole-heartedly taking on the religion of their oppressor w/o question! How does that add up in comparison to the Jews and Black Muslims you speak of..

LOL..do you really know how missionaries work? They don't go to poor improvised areas and tempt starving people with bread if they convert. Missionaries help establish Christianity (help build churches, donate Bibles, lead in prayer,etc.) in places where it already exists. Often times, they go out in the community as well to assist in any way they can. Nobody is forced or coerced into Christianity.

Whether or not it was forced upon slaves doesn't take away the fact that it is not a "white man" religion. There are other religions that have been spread by war---convert or be killed. This is not exclusive to Christianity.

I've been over this in numerous threads debating Christianity. Both sides have presented their sides and evidence and it all comes down to faith/belief.

I, like many other black Christians, have made the decision to personally become Christians..not just because it was handed down to us.

But why should it bother you? Nobody is forcing you to convert, so if a person chooses to live as a Christian, so be it.

If you don't believe in God, then no harm done. If you adhere to another religion, most that I know of say let non-believers be.

njfashionista wrote:

<quoted text>
LOL..do you really know how missionaries work? They don't go to poor improvised areas and tempt starving people with bread if they convert. Missionaries help establish Christianity (help build churches, donate Bibles, lead in prayer,etc.) in places where it already exists. Often times, they go out in the community as well to assist in any way they can. Nobody is forced or coerced into Christianity.
Whether or not it was forced upon slaves doesn't take away the fact that it is not a "white man" religion. There are other religions that have been spread by war---convert or be killed. This is not exclusive to Christianity.
I've been over this in numerous threads debating Christianity. Both sides have presented their sides and evidence and it all comes down to faith/belief.
I, like many other black Christians, have made the decision to personally become Christians..not just because it was handed down to us.
But why should it bother you? Nobody is forcing you to convert, so if a person chooses to live as a Christian, so be it.
If you don't believe in God, then no harm done. If you adhere to another religion, most that I know of say let non-believers be.

Well stated.

I'm done wrangling with you, justiz4once. My position is clearly stated in my posts, and I'm content to agree to disagree with you. :)

It was never a black or white thing with me, as a child I knew of a man name Jesus, who I was always taught was Hebrew, he was the Son of God, and he died for all man kind on the cross, and through the cross all have salvation and everlasting life with him. That a power story that trancends all races and all cultures!

Hee hee! I seem to be irking someone with my posts who apparently does not have the guts or the balls to engage me.

Feel free to judge this one as well. LOL! I am here enjoying my life and you are there killing yourself with your hate for Christianity. Muhahahahah!

Christianity is really not about religion but relationship w/ Jesus Christ.

Just my 2 cent. And I WILL NOT debate about this issue either.

People are going to believe however they want to believe which is fine, that's what makes this a great country. There is an interesting article about Africans and christianity.(posted below) God is not a respecter of persons, I am tired of ppl bringing God and christianity down to a human level, Jesus is for everyone who believes, humans are who made this a "color/race" issue, our ancestors being enslaved was a horrific time in our history, but it doesn't mean Jesus didn't/doesn't exist, and it certainly doesn't mean it's a white mans religion. Watching Prof. Henry Gates yesterday on local cable, his travels throughout African, Ethiopians were christians in Africa some 1200 yrs before being influenced by Arab invaders (something like that. I think if more ppl truly practiced christianity in action and not just lip service, our community could heal.

http://www.allaboutreligion.org/history-of-ch...

njfashionista wrote:

Can this not be said of all religions? Most people are born into their faith and many don't adhere to their religion's practices.
Growing up around a lot of Jewish people I saw the same things. I live near Philadelphia which has a large black Muslim population and the only thing Muslim about a lot of them are their beards.
Why single out black Christians?

Africans in America should single out Christians because in many of our communities, "Ushers (Pastors/Reverend) are the de facto leaders. JUSTIZ4ONCE, post was 100 percent accurate. If you ask most Africans in America where Christianity came from - they would answer Jesus? They would be wrong. If you said the Catholic Church - they would argue. My point if you do not know the foundation of your religion, how can it give information to address today's reality. Explaining why so many Christians are passive. The same can be said of Islam - many Africans in America accept Islam and immediately think it is their duty to be Arabs. As if Arabs treated us better than Caucasians. In the Middle East and North Africa, the indigenous persons are darker skinned individual but today they are ostracized. In Judaism, Caucasian of the Jewish Faith are not the original Jew. The original Jews are from Ethiopia and Zionist refused their entry into Israel. My point is hypocrisy is in other faiths but due to the fact, Christianity is followed by the masses - the focus must be on Christianity.

Flycity wrote:

Hee hee! I seem to be irking someone with my posts who apparently does not have the guts or the balls to engage me.
Feel free to judge this one as well. LOL! I am here enjoying my life and you are there killing yourself with your hate for Christianity. Muhahahahah!

you seem to be begging for attention... I haven't engaged you b/c the post was directed towards american blacks..

You are not in a third world country, your choice to be christian is on your own accord; it does not compare to that of American blacks.

What are your opinions on how christianity was introduced to America blacks?

I barely have time to post, nevertheless judge...someone else must be smitten with your profound thoughts.

why are you being so exaggerative...I am having a discussion (the one you feel left out of)..not killing myself with hate.

justiz4once wrote:

<quoted text>
you seem to be begging for attention... I haven't engaged you b/c the post was directed towards american blacks..
You are not in a third world country, your choice to be christian is on your own accord; it does not compare to that of American blacks.
What are your opinions on how christianity was introduced to America blacks?
I barely have time to post, nevertheless judge...someone else must be smitten with your profound thoughts.
why are you being so exaggerative...I am having a discussion (the one you feel left out of)..not killing myself with hate.

Mmmmh! My post was in no way directed to you, it was directed at the person judging my posts negatively, but thank you for admitting that you are one judging my posts negatively.

Feel free to make more anti-Christian posts/thread and carry on killing yourself with anger, hate and frustration.

Judge this one as well sugar!

Bye bye!

FlyCity,

I assume you enter in the front door of your church and freely participate in church activities at will?

Now, would you go if you had to enter the back door? sit in the back?

Would your mom...grandparents...go?

Even if they were not allowed to speak their native tongue...and get beat daily for not clearly understanding the foreign one.

would you be so gunhoe about the religion, knowing that slavery in America was supported by christians?

Would you be so quick to declare yourself christian and adapt the beliefs of the person who kidnapped, murdered, raped, silenced your people/ family?? The ones who stripped you of your native belief, customs, language, religion...and gave you theirs? but wait...when they introduce you to theirs, you are not allowed to read, write, communicate with your peers, you just have to digust what they say wholeheartly....stuff like this..

'Slaves, be obedient to the men who are called your masters in the world, with deep respect and sincere loyalty as you are obedient to Christ....Work hard and willing...but do it for the sake of the Lord.'

I'm curious...would you adopt these beliefs, and christianity w/o question if this was your intro?

Flycity wrote:

<quoted text>
Mmmmh! My post was in no way directed to you, it was directed at the person judging my posts negatively, but thank you for admitting that you are one judging my posts negatively.
Feel free to make more anti-Christian posts/thread and carry on killing yourself with anger, hate and frustration.
Judge this one as well sugar!
Bye bye!

Fly City,

This is why I opted not to respond to you in the beginning. You never post anything of substance. You rant with a 'let me tell something banter' filled with tic for tac accusations and sophmoric wit.

You remind me of an annoying child that keeps interrupting while the grown ups talk.

While I continue to converse with the adults...you just keep trying to figure out who judged your post..

FlyCity <-------The only one on topix who cares about post judging!